Oregairu Zoku Episode 2

Oregairu_02_titleHis and her confessions won’t reach anyone.

Oregairu_02_01
Zoku_01
Zoku_02
Zoku_03

Starts off with a little flashback about Komachi handing him a list of presents, #1 obviously being the most important. By the way, they had a nod to the UNO match that was supposed to be in episode 1. Found it funny some people’s pants were pulled down, how does that work?

Zoku_04
Zoku_05
Zoku_07
Zoku_08
Zoku_09

The haunted mansion scene depicted as in the LN with some extras. Hachiman’s automatic gesture there was supposed to be one of his onii-chan skills which they omitted. They also kept the little rub from Yui when she smashes his head from fright. Also, Tobe pls.

Zoku_10
Zoku_11
Zoku_12
Zoku_13
Zoku_14

Their visit to the Nanzen-ji Temple. Yukino showing off her obsession with cats as usual, I guess tigers count. Hachiman takes note that Hayama seems to be up to something regarding their attempts at getting Tobe and Ebina some alone time, which he keeps to himself. Yukino isn’t able to help as much directly, but she did some research for possible locations that girls would like, sasuga Yukinon. All of this smiling Yukino, it hurts knowing what’s going to happen for a few episodes after this.

Zoku_15
Zoku_17

Two important conversations that give you an idea of what Miura and Ebina think of the group they’re in. Miura in particular is a bit more vocal about what it is she wants to remain the same while Ebina leaves it up to Hachiman to figure out her request. Their group is treading on a fine line between staying together and breaking apart, especially with Tobe’s upcoming confession. This also goes to show the other characters are a lot more observant than they let on, at least when it comes to their own surroundings. So it turns out they’re a group of characters with more depth than your average popular groupies.

Zoku_16
Zoku_18
Zoku_19
Zoku_20
Zoku_21
Zoku_22
Zoku_23

I see a lot of people thinking Yukino’s “out of character,” but apparently people forget what happened in the Cultural Festival arc in season 1. This scene in particular is pretty representative of how much development these three have gone through. Though, exactly how much closer they’ve gotten is up for debate given what’s going to happen in the next volume. The trio’s a good parallel to Hayama’s group. Also, Yukino drinking tea after getting tired from the hike, funny. It does make me wonder what they could possibly be thinking as they watched him eat the meat buns. Yukitoki in instrumental form, how nostalgic. They also omitted the breakfast the three had together at a Nagoya cafe, their visit to whatever temple to pray for Komachi’s exam success, and so forth. My Service Club slice of life, no!

Zoku_24
Zoku_25
Zoku_26

The background scenery is pretty fucking sugoi. They stick out in every picture and it’s nice to show how much care they’re putting into it. Destinyland’s going to be a treat. That said, they picked out the bamboo shoots as the place for the inevitable confession. Yui clearly liked the place.

Zoku_27
Zoku_29
Zoku_28

Clash of ideals. Hayama likes his group the way it is, but Hachiman sees it nothing more than a facade of superficiality, something that he hates the most. What’s so fun about pretending to be friends? Who knows, but Hayama doesn’t think of it that way. In the end, Hayama can’t decide on anything and leaves it to Hachiman to keep his group from falling apart, which is in line with what Miura and Ebina want. Hachiman isn’t exactly pleased by this either.

Zoku_30
Zoku_31
Zoku_32
Zoku_33
Zoku_34
Zoku_35

Time for the confession. Tobe’s on his way to being turned down for sure, but Hachiman has a plan. The two leave it up to him since they trust he’ll do something about it. Hayama’s expression says quite a bit about what he’s thinking. And also Hachiman’s stream of logical thoughts leading him to his plan to keeping Tobe from getting hurt–rather, Hayama’s group from being destroyed internally. Yukino and Yui are completely unaware of this, evident by how surprised by his sudden dash towards Tobe.

Zoku_36
Zoku_37
Zoku_38
Zoku_39
Zoku_40
Zoku_42
Zoku_41

Instead of Tobe confessing, Hachiman steals the spotlight and does it instead. Everyone’s surprised save for Hayama; he had an idea Hachiman would do something like this. He knew, but he still chose to let him do it, just so he could keep his group together. Fortunately for Tobe,  he didn’t get directly rejected and they were able to establish the fact that Ebina wasn’t looking to date anyone. He’s effectively allowed them to continue their group charade for a little longer. Tobe’s a good guy, a bit annoying though. This self-sacrifice is a bit smaller in scale compared to his verbal abuse of Sagami, but the actual side effects run a bit deeper. We got to see Yui’s expression, but Yukino’s mostly obscured from the viewer, a good way to indicate how she’s feeling regarding the matter.

Zoku_43
Zoku_45
Zoku_44

Yukino’s upset about his way of doing things. What exactly was she upset about? We wait a few more episodes to find out. To me, I think this marks the conflict that’s the heart of the series. The series started off with a match between the two, “Whoever can serve the most people win.” So it’s essentially a competition between their approach at problems and it’s really only until this scene in particular that how they handle things start to run in parallel to each other. This conflict also builds further on the dynamic relationship that exists between Hachiman and Yukino that I honestly think doesn’t exist with any other character. And this is also the first time in which Yukino directly and active shows her dislike for his methods. Just to add regarding to Yukino’s reason for being upset, consider the theme of superficiality in this series. You can also call it deception, lies, sophistry, whatever. Which two characters hate these things the most? Our duo protagonists, of course. Obviously, this isn’t the only reason since Hiratsuka-sensei’s sage advice during the Cultural Festival also comes to mind. “Just because you’re not hurting doesn’t meant others who are watching you aren’t.” And if you take into account their slowly, festering relationship as represented in their time alone together from earlier in the episode (sharing food), there is (are) someone (people) who is (are) bound to be hurt/upset. Yukino may have said no to his +Facebook Friend Request, but they really are friends at this point in the story which by the way, is a good segue into introducing romance elements into the story–Not Yui related, of course, but that’s another story altogether.

Zoku_47
Zoku_46
Zoku_48
Zoku_49

Great music here. So Yui didn’t like what he did either. His excuse, it was efficient. It’s efficient, but it wasn’t very considerate. Considerate to who? I wonder. Notice how he was rubbing his fingers as he was making up excuses to why he did what he did. He also realizes that he was doing what he hated: deception, trying to rationalize something that isn’t true, sophistry. Protip: this ties in with the reason why Yukino’s upset from earlier. I think it’s pretty obvious why Yui wasn’t okay with it, crushing on him and all.

Zoku_50
Zoku_51
Zoku_52
Zoku_53

Ebina’s heart-to-heart talk about how rotten she is, and by extension, Hachiman. It turns out these two might be able to get along better than you’d expect. And the final three shots gives you an idea of the effects of Hachiman’s stunt on the three of them. Yukino still seems to be brooding over the matter from last night, Hachiman’s alone on the roof of the station, and Yui’s still in her living group. Hachiman’s final line of him being the biggest liar is an interesting one, too.

Overall Impressions:
I liked the episode, it was really good. The scene transitions were a bit jarring since they jumped from one thing to another, but ultimately, the confession scene was handled brilliantly. The music directing is pretty superb too, especially the Yukitoki instrumental and the tune after the confession. My expectations for the rollercoaster scene are going out of control. I said it before, but the attention to detail on the gestures is delicious. Feel definitely made me feel something this episode. Voice acting for the trio were phenomenal as well, especially Hachiman.

 

Anyway, this ends volume 7 and marks the start of the conflict that’s the heart of this series. Next episode appears to be covering up to chapter 4 if the title is any indicator, but we should see Iroha, Haruno, and new opening animation, goodbye placeholder. And so starts the cold war between Yukino and Hachiman as well as Yukino’s eventual defrosting.

 

I was supposed to write less but oh well. I’ll try to refrain next time, since I’m not too particularly good at writing out my thoughts. Also, what the fuck happened to you Kamakura? FEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEELZoku_54

So let’s talk a little about Hachiman (and Yukino).

Just reading around and it’s kind of scary how off-base a lot of people can be, though I can easily be as well.

First, let’s start off with some details regarding Hachiman. He’s rotten, he’s a very logical (important) thinker, has a bad history with girls, has low self-esteem, supposedly loathes superficiality, and hates the idea of changing to fit in with others. These are all things we understand about him or get an idea of as early as the first volume. So it’s easy to get an idea of why he does what he does; it’s because he really doesn’t have all that much to lose which isn’t a very healthy mindset for a boy in high school. That said, he gets by in life just fine.

The problem now is that really isn’t true anymore. Currently, there are two people who are steadily climbing up his “things to treasure” list: Yukino and Yui. Obviously, the same applies to those two in regards to him. He may not realize it, but that’s their relationship now.

So let’s make some parallels of the Service Club with Hayama’s clique. What’s the difference? The former lacks the superficial shackles that plague the latter. Rightfully so, since Hachiman and Yukino won’t have any of that when they’re around.

Consider the conversation Hachiman and Hayama had at the riverbank. Hayama thinks his group dynamic isn’t superficial, Hachiman does. This is representative of their polar opposite ideologies. It’s also a good parallel to their two groups (again).

Fast forward to the confession in episode 2/end of volume 7. His impromptu solution is a fake confession to Ebina to avoid Tobe from getting rejected that could potentially cause their group to explode internally–This was what Ebina, Miura, and Hayama wished for. So what does this solution of his ultimately solve? It allows him to fulfill Ebina, Miura, and Hayama’s request as well as sidelining Tobe’s request for x number of length. Now let’s look at the deeper implications. He chose to protect the shallow bonds of a group that he honestly didn’t really care all that much about. He chose to place value on things that he was supposed to hate and loathe. And these are all the things he hated straight from episode 1 of season 1/volume 1. He essentially changed his ideology in order to protect something superficial which was ironically, the very first thing he argued about when he met Yukino.

For Yui, it’s understandable to see her get upset; she likes the guy and she has an idea of what kind of things he does to get things done. But for Yukino, it goes a bit deeper than that. The fake confession really wasn’t the issue to her, but the implications and aftermath of it. I don’t think Hachiman was hurt as much some people seem to imply from the rejection. One thing the anime kind of suggested at was Hayama’s pity for Hachiman, at least, that’s his interpretation of it. He’s more hurt by the fact that someone else was looking down on his way of life, pitying him because he’s this way. Of course, I’m sure he was hurt by how Yukino and Yui reacted as well.

So let’s talk about Yukino. She’s honest, the type to tackle things head-on, she always takes the straight path, confronts anything she sees wrong, absolutely loathes superficiality, and dislikes people who pretend to be something they’re not, that is, acting fake. This, just like Hachiman, are things we get a notion of as early as volume 1. So our two protagonists, while at different starting points on the map, are walking on the same road to the same destination.

Then we have Yukino’s position in regards to Hachiman. She shares the same idea that superficiality is pointless and that they have no value. While Yukino may be harsh to Hachiman, she recognizes and appreciates the honesty that Hachiman has. For dumb things, he gives the dumbest excuses, but when it comes to problems that matter, he solves them honestly and brutally; regardless of the outcome, he doesn’t make any excuses. He upholds this attitude as early as their first meeting to the solution with Sagami during the Cultural Festival. And this is where he is essentially constructing this image to Yukino whose too honest. It probably wasn’t intentional on his part, but that’s exactly what side effects are; Yukino now has this constructed notion that Hachiman is the way he is and that there really isn’t any reason why’d he suddenly do a 180 on his ideologies and she certainly does appreciate this. So in the same way Hachiman held her in a pedestal, it’s very like Yukino does the same thing with him.

Now consider the request. Just by nature of the one who asked for help, Yukino is already limited to what she can do to contribute, but she does whenever she’s able. She’s also kept in the dark most of the time since Hachiman typically doesn’t really consult with her or Yui all that much about anything except for simple things. So they end up leaving Hachiman in charge of getting the job done when he stated that he had some kind of plan to get the problem resolved. So there is some level of trust between the three of them, at least, that’s what the two think. Of course, little did they know that he’d actually do something that was completely out of left field, both as a solution and for his entire character.

And then, the sudden fake confession. Yukino’s confused. Why would you do something that went against your very nature? Weren’t you supposed to be someone who wouldn’t change, especially not in the face of superficial nonsense? What does that say about our relationship then? Were we, ultimately, just two strangers in the same clubroom, connected only by the title of the Service Club? (This is actually more volume 8-ish, but I’ll add it here anyway). How would prolonging something brittle that will end eventually help anyone? If you’re going to contradict yourself this way, are you going to continue doing that for every single thing in the future? (A cycle of regret and self-abasement).

Yukino (apparently people are too busy generalizing her character as a unkind bitch or something when it’s the complete opposite) isn’t upset because she’s selfish or anything of the sort, you could even say she’s upset on his behalf; you can also say she was hurt which I believe she was, maybe not to the extent as Yui, however. As I mentioned above, Yukino had expectations of him, an idealization of him even. But that was instantly dashed with just this single confession; he went against everything he stood for as well as destroying this notion she had of him, the notion that was solidified by their interactions together, his behavior, his attitude, and so forth for the past six months, the notion that made them similar and represented what they mutually shared. And perhaps, her relationship with Hachiman wasn’t as genuine as she had thought it to be because she just doesn’t know Hachiman anymore.

It’s because Yukino’s too honest, kind even, that she can’t stay quiet about what he did. She isn’t able to sweep things under the rug if she sees that they’re wrong like Hachiman can. Her confronting attitude may be annoying to some people, but it’s because she’s like this that she can affect Hachiman in ways that Yui (or anyone else for that matter) can’t. People who have a single-track mind in things they do will continue to be that way until told otherwise. But that’s not to say they can just outright tell him, “You’re doing everything wrong because x.” It’s because they don’t understand everything. That’s exactly why Yukino finds it frustrating when she isn’t able to put her dislike of his methods into words. It should’ve made sense, but yet, it didn’t. Factor in the fact she’s growing closer to him, it makes it even harder to accept (a lot of people seem to be ignoring the last arc of the first season for some reason). I’ll also add Hiratsuka-sensei’s line about how “getting scolded means someone is watching you.” So Yukino does care about him, to what extent, we don’t really know, but she cares enough that she would blow a fuse over something he did, which is a 180 from who she was 6 volumes (1 season) ago. So, yes, character development for both Hachiman (crapping on his way of life for the sake of others) and Yukino (showing concern and anger for someone she truly believed she could genuinely get along with over that single thing they shared).

There are some people who find it strange that Yukino gets angry here, but not during the Cultural Festival when his reputation plummets. For one thing, Yukino wasn’t there to see what he did directly, the only thing she could do was interpret what happened based on what Hayama and Sagami were like when they went back. But the confession was the first time she was able to see in-person what his methods do and accomplish. An even bigger issue is how fundamentally different both solutions are. One was for the sake of getting the request done, no superficiality. The confession solution was the same except with the superficiality. It’s kind of like the difference between seeing what happens in front of you versus hearing about what happened, you react differently; the severity of your reaction depends on the situation. Season 1 omitted the scene, but Yukino did have a chat with Hachiman about what it is that he did after the rooftop scene. She tells him that “he tries to save anyone,” something which he denies. But I think this scene in particular shows she has a grasp of what he’s like, though she didn’t think he’d actually do that fake confession of his to preserve Hayama’s group.

I’ll also add something from volume 10. Yukino doesn’t mind being hated as long as there are people who can understand her. Even if it’s just one individual who genuinely understands her, it doesn’t matter what the world says about her, rumors, etc. Very important when you realize her life in elementary and junior versus high school. The former without the Service Club and the latter with them. But I digress.

Ultimately, Hachiman’s confession was able to solve the issue with Hayama’s group, but consequently and ironically, ended up fracturing his own. What’s important is what the implications of his act were, not so much the idea of turning down implied confessions or whatnot, though I won’t argue against or for regarding those points.

Anyway, I think I’ll do something like this for Yukino when the anime finishes volume 8 though most of the above interpretation has volume 8 details in it already. I also wrote all the above in a hurry, so I don’t think I have everything right. Will add or fix later, I guess.

Oh, and here’s a random update on chapter 2: It’s in the middle of editing. Irohafags need to wait just a little longer.

Advertisements

208 thoughts on “Oregairu Zoku Episode 2

  1. Notice that they used the first season’s op as a instrutmental ost in one scene? But depsite all of that it was a great episode which didn’t disappoint. I expect great things from Feel.

    • There’s no mention of Isshiki yet, but i guess we’ll see her next episode, given the pace the whole thing is going. 🙂

    • If they’re going to continue this pace I would be devastated, so hopefully they take their time now that this arc is done. I am excited to see Isshiki though since she’s one of my favorite characters so its going to be interesting how they’re going to adapt the election arc.

  2. I just saw it. Great Episode, i totally love it.
    Still a bit rushed, but at least, Excorsism got it perfectly: the unsaid it’s been properly conveyed with looks and reactions.

  3. Yeah the transitions still feels…off but good episode regardless. much better than the first. i sure hope iroha gets intoduced next week. all we got from the preview was kamakura after all.

  4. Will you make a birthday post for Iroha, Spyro-sama? (Like what you did with Yukinon) It’s 16th April. A day before episode 3 airing 😉

  5. yumiko got some nerve, Hachiman never did try anything but she warns him to stop , she doesn’t know how to ask a favour

  6. If ebina wanted to make the request make it straight forward, why in round about manner. If she was clear maybe the whole club would have helped her and hachiiman didn’t have to be the bad guy

    • That wouldn’t work because Yui was there. Ebina doesn’t want the group to change, and speaking about it to Yui would definitely have an effect on her and quite possibly the entire group.

    • i think yukinon like hachiman since culture festival, for the first time there is someone stand up for her

    • It’s because Ebina Hina is a nice girl that doesn’t engage in silly gossip. Everyone else that was there realized why Hachiman did what he did, even those useless background characters Yamataro and Ookaru-whatever. If anything, everyone’s impression of him was improved. Well, except for a couple people.

      I think this also contributed towards the reason Yumiko was able to trust the service club with her anxieties later on.

  7. Hachiman is terrible man, he just made the girl who likes him cry and that to twice(work place visit), who knows maybe Yukino is crying too.

  8. No one got hurt except himself. From his experience, he knew the drastic effect of a rejected confession on one’s social school life . Look at the middle school version of 8MAN… Every student in his class labelled him a creep after his awkward confession to Kaori and kept their distance which as a result, made him a loner he is today. He was severely misunderstood and ostracized over that incident . Inspite of knowing that, he took the fall for Tobe and thus committed a social suicide because If rumours were to spread among the school body about his confession, the same scenario would be repeated as back in his middle school days.

    • Well, he didn’t hurt himself because he wasn’t bothered by it. But he did end up hurting someone after all. For reasons he hadn’t considered.

    • @globaltornado: On the contrary, Hachiman did hurt himself. Even if he tries to shrug it off or reasons why he does it, remember that its all sophistry and its his way of coping with the pain (like in the cultural festival, you can see the expression of anxiousness in Hachiman’s face (and I think the fidgeting of his hand?) to expect what he’s about to do to Sagami on the rooftop. Then when he’s left alone on the rooftop, he shows pain but he accepts it since that’s what he’s always done to get the job done. Of course as you said he never considered how others could get hurt from his methods.

    • He’s hurt. Every time Hachiman does something unpleasant, he gets hurt.
      It’s just used to pain, he’s good at hiding it and locking it away in his heart.
      You can feel it in the novel too: he learned to take the positive ( even if there isn’t any ) from the negative events.

      There’s no such things as not being hurt. Humans gets hurt all the time even with stupid reasons, they just get better at dealing with the aftermath.

      He also knew that a fake confession was a bad move, that’s why he was so reluctant to do it in the first place.
      Yet, it was the only choice and he knew he is better than anyone in dealing with pain.

      Yet again, a world where no one is hurt, except him. This time thou, it didn’t do so well. This time there’s two people who care about him.
      Something he’s not used to, and couldn’t predict.

  9. great episode, the music was amazing, now is time to wait for one of my favorites monologues the “what if” scenarios, if feel screw up that monologue i wont forgive them

  10. I was supposed to write less but oh well. I’ll try to refrain next time, since I’m not too particularly good at writing out my thoughts.

    Spyro pls.

  11. Please do keep writing these. No one’s more informed on the series than you are, so I’d love to hear more of your thoughts.

  12. Hm…so I’m guessing three episodes for Vol. 8 and four for Vol. 9? That still leaves AT LEAST three left so are we gonna be getting Vol. 10?

    • Watari Wataru actually wrote the story is nearing it’s end in vol. 10 afterword, so i think maybe this season will cover all published material, go ahead and conclude it. They cleared 6 volumes in 1st one, no reason not to do the same in this one…

  13. …… And the bathing with Totsuka!? Speaking of, Yukino getting hand feed should happen in every episode! (and by every character if posible, heh)

    So far, while the designs can be considered “plain” (specially when the chars aren’t doing anything), they do look nice when the guys are expressing their feelings (due to the pacing, that’s pretty much all we see); so pretty much the only complain so far is the pacing, but Feel is indeed doing a pleasant job even though they are forcing themselves to rush things up

  14. It does make me wonder what they could possibly be thinking as they watched him eat the meat buns.

    About the same he thinks when watching Yukijno eat plus “wow guys. Guys big and eat big”.

  15. Well, this is the main contender for best episode, if FEEL do not butcher the genuine and someday help me scene

  16. He also realizes that he was doing what he hated: deception, trying to rationalize something that isn’t true, sophistry. Protip: this ties in with the reason why Yukino’s upset from earlier.

    Can you explain this more to me? Im confused what you mean here. I thought she was mad cause he was hurting himself again as well but not im not sure?

    • I think you’re pretty much on the target with that one. If you refer to what Hiratsuka said to Hachiman in the Cultural festival as well as what Yuigahama said to Hachiman in the Bamboo forest, Yukino hates how Hachiman is hurting himself just to protect the status quo. I think you also have to look back into the current last two volumes, but if it helps, consider what Yukino wants. That’ll help to understand another reason why she was disappointed and hated Hachiman’s modus operandi.

    • @Radiator: I was referring to the last two volumes (I forgot which one had the quote I was looking) but Yukino says out to Hachiman that she at first want something that Haruno and Hachiman had that she didn’t, but then she now wants something that the two of them don’t have. Its easier to understand how Yukino is hurt by knowing what Hachiman hates about himself. (refer to end of volume five for another hint and think of Yukino’s point of view)

    • @Rahul Kumar: At the end, Hachiman talks about hating himself for placing expectations and thinking that he knew what kind of person Yukino is. You can consider that as parallelism to Yukino who thought she understood Hikigaya and admired a particular trait of him (first example at the top of my head: when Yukino murmurs “…So there’re things you don’t understand too.” in the community center after hearing Hachiman says he has no idea how to solve the problem (volume 9, Chapter 7)). Until the concert and then the confession scene she realized she hated his methods because he was hurting himself and he betrayed his own beliefs, the beliefs that she actually respected from Hachiman. There might be more to be said about Yukino’s paradigms and etc. but that’s pretty much what my hint was referring to.

      P.S Still trying to find that quote but I’m pretty sure its in volume 10 that Yukino talks about chasing after Haruno and Hachiman and looking for something that they’re missing, but it really helps to interpret why she’s upset in the confession scene.

    • So from what I understand, at the end of Volume 5, Hachiman was upset after Haruno accidentally spilled the beans about the accident because he thought he understood Yukinoshita. “And who is that airhead with you?” I didn’t really think much of it, but looking from Hachiman’s perspective I can see how it’s a lie. Because of the accident, she should’ve at least seen Hachiman before. And so it was a lie because it made Hiratsuka and Hachiman think it was their first time meeting. So yeah it’s pretty obvious what Hachiman hates about himself.

      I think I wasn’t paying enough attention. Looking back at what Hiratsuka said, I now realize that Hachiman was really hurting himself with the slogan he made and with what he said to Sagami. At that time, it really didn’t seem like Yukinoshita was mad at him. Although it might’ve been because everything Hachiman was doing was to help fulfill the request Yukinoshita took (despite saying they should hold off on club activities), and he told her that her way of doing things was wrong, so she didn’t really have room to complain about someone else’s way of doing things.

    • Well, the difference between volume 6 and 7 was whether Yukino had been actually able to see him do what he does in person and this isn’t including something like the Rumi arc, which was ultimately a collaboration between everyone.

      In volume 6, at most she could only deduce what happened based on Sagami and Hayama’s behavior when they got back whereas volume 7, she was able to see him in person and immediately figure out the intended implications of his fake confession. And after volume 6, they’re obviously friends even if they don’t acknowledge it openly, so that’s certainly a factor in making her more upset than usual.

    • @dualash7 So Yukino is sad because 8Man hurts himself too not because she loves him?
      It is clear that Yui is sad because She loves him(it is clear from first volume) but about why Yukinoshita is sad unclear. Maybe they will make it clear in further episodes or volume 9 and 10

  17. Yup, the transitions still feel weird since they don’t match very well until you get what happens in between, but after seeing this episode I’m glad they were consistent with the atmosphere. And nevertheless, Studio Feel did a great job with the arc with the time they could afford for the season.

    P.S I was dying from laughter when I saw Kamakura. Its like he’s a pokemon, changing from Ponkan’s illustration to season one’s design, and then season two….great job Feel….great job…

    • Ah thanks for explaining that! Makes a lot more sense now. So basically its what I said earlier about him hurting himself ! Im not sure what your getting at about her wants cause isnt her want just for Hachiman to stop hurting himself for others?

    • @dualash, yes yukinon said that she said hiki and haruno has something that she want has something they dont have, i thought it just her growing but haruno and hayama think she still the same

  18. Yeah, I think it’s really those two things that made Yukino upset about Hachiman’s way of doing things. He basically lied about wanting to go out with Ebina to fulfill both Tobe and Ebina’s requests, and also to fulfill Hayama’s desire to protect the status quo. (Btw I kind of agree with Hachiman. Their friendship is superficial, because if that’s all it takes to ruin the friendship, then it’s shallow. True friendship has a solid foundation and can’t be brought down that easily.) And then the second reason is that both Yukino and Yui like him. Yukino rejected his +Facebook Friend Request, but we’ve seen her blushing a couple times so it’s pretty obvious she likes him. It’s also pretty obvious that Yui likes him (i.e. blushing when asking for his phone number). So yeah, he used lies to make everything work out but in the end it was a lie and he ended up hurting both Yukino and Yui.

    • it is obviously, yukinon falling to hachiman, in chapter 8, i think the reason why yukinon tell hachiman not to come to club if he doesnt want that bcos yukinon doesnt like his methode that unconciously that hurt yukinon too

    • I know right, it’s so very uncute now. Oh and btw, I like the details here and there. Like Kawasaki sobbing. And How Yukino’s friend stared at her and Hikigaya and so many other details. This is going to be very good. The HYPE!

  19. I hv a question to ask , when Ebina tells 8Man that maybe they could be in relationship was she serious ? I hvn’t read LN but when 8Man rejects her , her eyes changes like she is hurt

    Also is volume 7 really over, so I can read that volume without getting spoiled about further episodes. Right?

    • I think you can treat it as a joke since as Ebina said, she doesn’t want to ruin what she currently has in her group and life right now, but you can say that it was a way of complimenting Hachiman since she knows what kind of sacrifices he made to fulfill his request (also they both share similar beliefs so she’s referring how she could get use to a person like Hachiman in a relationship), that’s why she’s not hurt she’s just surprised by Hachiman’s response since it was sort of a joke in bad taste in terms of their similar attitudes.

      Also yes, that was the end of volume 7 so you can read it and next episode should be onto volume 8.

  20. the author of this Ln is. the worst! his logic despice human calibre. for pete’s sake. ya’ know yukinon feeling for hachiman is just an admiration. and not love let’s just savor the taste of this story thanks! spyro specialy the author i know ya’r scouting this translation body! thanks you’re briliant!

    • It’s true that both Hachiman and Yukino have admiration for each other, but speaking personally, admiration can easily turn into love.

    • Maybe you haven’t notice the world “love” in “love comedy” in 10 volumes’ titles.
      Don’t worry, it’s a common problem to jump words in many consecutive books….

      Try reading again the volumes, this time with all the words in the title.. Maybe you’ll get WHY everyone here is thinking that Yukino ( and Yui too ) is in love with Hachiman.

      I apologize if my sarcasm is leaving you any bruise on your pride… 😛

  21. I was confused about why the girls disliked his doing when I read the novel, luckily they did some explanation in the anime.

  22. God, I’ve yet to read Vols. 1-6 as I skipped it after S1. Please, spyro keep doing these episodic writeups/thoughts! So at this rate volume 10 won’t get adapted? Because I think it’d be too cramped if they did.

  23. That FEELing… Plain chardesign and great backgrounds. Good music but voices just not match S1 characters (where is my cheeky Komachi?). Tempo much better than ep1, still to much juicy scenes out. Though thanks for Kawasomething – she’s great. Ebina is good too. Yumiko lost some sharpness – she was more hostile before. And what they did it to poor Kamakura? Imposter infiltrated Hikigaya household!

  24. Read volume 7 , really nice volume
    But didn’t they changed the scene in anime when they accept Tobe’s request
    In LN they make it like there is no say of 8Man in the decision while in Anime the last decision is taken by Hachiman

  25. I hv a little question
    ““Tobe, why did you come to us for this request?
    Hm? Ya know, it’s that. Hayato suggested and pushed me here, ya know?”

    Did Hayama sends Tobe to 8Man knowing that 8Man will save their group by sacrificing himself
    If it is true that he is a shitty selfish brat. I hate that shit. Someone please smack him

    • “If i can’t make Tobe stop, maybe Hachiman can.”
      That’s what Hayama thinks.
      Yeah, he’s selfish. He doesn’t want to remove his good guy mask. Probably he can’t ( family matters, imho ).

      I think that Hayama vs Hachiman is actually Social Behavior VS Personal Behaviour. Being the only son of rich people is hard in many aspects, you know.

    • He is damn selfish
      Sacrificing others t achieve his own goal and striving to maintain his image
      I hvn’t read vol 8,9,10 but I guess the reason why Yukinon hate him is that Hayama is a shitty, selfish brat

    • i doubt it.
      I guess it’s because Hayama didn’t protect Yukino when she was bullied at school.
      Actually there are a lot of hints about this in the LN.

    • No, but if you look at the first anime serie, during the Ruri Arc… when Hayama said “i want to do what i can” , Yukino answers “It’s impossibile, you couldn’t before..”

      Pretty obvious to me…

  26. Just watch the episode and it was pretty good. Surprise how fast the volume end or how they covered a volume in 2 episodes but ah well. They might be thing of adding in those side stories after all.

    Knowing that everyone is just relying on or using Hachiman and making it seem like he Hachiman came to the final decision on his own accord gives a somewhat complicated feeling. I guess its cause the don’t show what he’s thinking all the time like the LN.

    Well next episode should be where the ‘fun’ begins and to say, I have yet to be disappointed from this season.

  27. I feel like Ebina’s reaction from anime and LN were different, after her playful confession. Or was it because Hikigaya was quite blunt?

    In first half watching the trio smile every time reminded me what struggle lies ahead. BGM placement, pacing and spacing were nice.

    Ebina’s request to Hikigaya near the temple(??) and her reply to Miura gave chills.

  28. If Yui had asked Ebina prior to them taking on the confession request, all this could have been avoided. In this case, her feelings were what mattered the most, and they didn’t take them into consideration. Its ironic Yui lectures Hiki about taking other people’s feelings into account when she didn’t in the 1st place. Its implied Ebina, is going through some stuff and her friendships (however shallow) are her support group. Taking that away from her would have been cruel. Hiki was in the wrong but I’m more disappointed in Yuki and Yui. Had either taken everything into account they would have seen Hiki’s actions were necessary.

    • Well, the best solution would have been to ask Ebina whether she’s even interested in dating at the moment but Yui probably wanted it to work out. She probably doesn’t know as much as Miura does, and even Miura’s knowledge is limited.

      I don’t quite feel like Hachiman was in the wrong. Having been in the same sort of situation, I can say with certainty sometimes it’s either you yourself get hurt or you let everyone else get hurt (I was part of a dance team and our leader was negative and goal-oriented, but I wanted to protect the efforts of my friends). I’m sure Yui and Yukino both understood that it was an efficient way to fulfill both requests, but that didn’t stop them from feeling upset. The thing is though that Hachiman understood what Ebina wanted so imo there was another way for him to not get rejected (i.e. force Tobe to give up and leave). I’m pretty sure that other option is why Hachiman’s “efficient” argument was a fallacious argument.

  29. I always get irritated seeing hayama’s group especially by Hayama & Miura, and the way she talked to Hikki makes her more shallow than I thought she was, so fake & repulsive both inside & outside, well Ebina is no better either, I’d say Tobe is at least honest with what he wants.

    • The heck? Miura isn’t mother Teresa, but she’s a pretty nice girl that looks after her friends. Even after Yui tries to tell her that she wants to get along with Yukinoshita, a person Miura can’t seem to stand, she never gives Yui shit about it and stays friends with her. She’s also very direct and honest. Yukino acknowledges this later, well, after they almost got into a fight.

      I think you may be transferring negative emotions from childhood traumas on to Yumiko just because she is pretty and blonde.

    • When she talked to Hachiman, she was just trying to do the same thing Hayama was trying to do. Protect the status quo. Ebina isn’t fake? She wants the same thing Hayama wants. Sure, she beat around the bush with her request, but imo it’s hard to say what you want sometimes. Anyways Miura definitely does try to protect her friends.

      The only thing I really dislike about Miura is that she’s pompous and forces her ideas on other people.
      “I’ll smash your cheap pride to bits.”

      As for the whole group itself, I agree with Hachiman. “If this is all it takes to tear you apart, then maybe you weren’t good friends at all.” “In my opinion, it’s messed up to try and make such shallow relationships work.”
      The relationships within the group are pretty shallow if they can be broken with Tobe’s confession. The strongest relationship within the group is probably the bond between Hayama and Miura.

    • Ebina’s final conversation with 8man is important here. As Miura says earlier in the episode, Ebina doesn’t talk about herself much and while the specifics are never laid out explicitly, one (or at least I did) gets the distinct impression Ebina is grappling with some heavier stuff in her personal or family life behind her somewhat placid and occasionally silly exterior.

      Ebina is fully aware that there’s a superficiality to the current status of her group with Hayama and cohorts and also acknowledges that it pains her to see that superficiality perpetuated and that there is a selfishness to her desires, but at the same time it’s something that she doesn’t want to lose because the current state of the group allows her some measure of comfort and happiness, a place of solace from whatever unspoken difficulties are part of her life elsewhere, and for that group to potentially splinter apart could be pretty damaging. Burying the tensions within the group back underground is easier and less painful, if of course temporary and inconclusive.

      There are definitely frustrating elements to Hayama and co’s behavior, and with 8man’s and the rests as well, it’s part of the good elements of this serious really, no one is really “in the wrong” in the confession situation, but are are sort of trying to muddle through these situations as they think is best, but of course those different interpretations end up coming into conflict.

    • @globaltornado really!!!!! I think Miura is a bitch, well I hvn’t read further volumes so maybe in further volumes she will so her true self which is nice

    • @Kawasomething Didn’t it makes all three (Hayama, Miura and Ebina) shitty person. To enjoy there youth they agrees seek help from the person about whom they didn’t cared and whom they hate. They didn’t even cared about feeling of 8Man and were ready even if he or other people will suffer just to maintain there happy life

      ALL THREE OF THEM ARE SELFISH SHITS. THE KIND OF PEOPLE I HATE THE MOST. THEY HAVE SOME IF NOT ALL THE TRAITS OF SAGAMIN- DESIRE TO MAINTAIN THERE LIFE STYLE EVEN IF SOMEONE WILL SUFFER BECAUSE OF THAT

  30. His and her confessions don’t reach anyone. What does her confession relate to? Did Hachiman confess to Ebina to prevent Yui confessing to him? He spent the whole episode shutting her down. Is that the reason he considers himself the biggest liar? Not because of the fake confession because of the reason the confession was done. I guess I have to reread the following chapters.

    • I think this is about Tobe and Ebina.
      *Tobe did not have the chance to tell his own confession to Ebina.

      *Ebina told her “confession” to 8man, that she is a rotten person. Her true reason for not wanting in a relationship atm.

      I think, basically these confession of theirs did not reach the person they want to say this to.

  31. well regarding Yukino’s case, i agree with you. i think that Yukino shares some trust and faith to Hachiman because their similarities.I think that his usual way of solving things is not what Yukino hated there, but something deeper, maybe it’s like what you said, she can’t accept he doing that for something superficial, which is hated by both of them. y’know, like you found someone who quite similar to you, getting closer, but then she/he do what you both supposedly hated.
    on Yui’s case, well, it’s obviously her feeling that got hurt.

  32. I love your write-ups and episode break downs Spyro! I think you should definitely do them for every episode (and keep them long as well)! That being said, I thought your analysis on Yukino and why she was angry was spot-on. I interpreted it pretty much the same way. I also thought that the soundtrack for this episode was done masterfully and the instrumental rendition of S1’s opening is absolutely perfect for the more dramatic scenes, so I can’t wait for it to be used in the upcoming episodes. I really like how much FEEL is foreshadowing future events and making clear juxtapositions so that anime-only watchers can understand the relationships between the characters. For example, all of the cutesie service club scenes (sharing food, the walk home, etc.) do a great job of showing how close the three have become (namely Yukino and Hachiman). Given how sour and desolate the mood is going to become in the next 6-7 episodes, these episodes are going to be perfect in showing how close they were with each other before the schism. Oh yeah, and I loved Hachiman’s chats with Miura and Hayama–the Miura chat especially. It played out in the anime exactly like it did in my head and I thought it was a nice insight into Miura’s role within the greater story. Also Hayama’s shoulders slumping after realizing he had to rely on Hachiman was a stroke of genius. Anyways, amazing episode and can’t wait for next week.

    • “Facebook Friend Request” is used figuratively because you can either accept or reject a friend request on Facebook, and what happened is similar to that. Look at the end of Volume 6 when they’re in the club room, but before Yuigahama comes in.

  33. Thanks spyro, cleared it up for me a bit! So, I take it as shes more upset that Hachiman basically went against everything that he was with the confession; especially because it was to fix something superficial. So she was partly disappointing/upset with his decision? Correct? hopefully, ha?

  34. I hv 2 questions after reading LN and watching anime
    1) Why is Yukinon sad after his confession- she loves her or because he has again sacrificed himself?
    2) Why Ebina said her request to service club in such a form so that only 8Man will be able to understand that? Because she desired Hachman to sacrifice himself and save their group? If that is so then just like Hayama she is a bitch.

    Please someone answer my questions. My curiosity is killing me

    • I would like to advice you to read the LN vol 7,8 if you are a LN reader.
      But regardless:
      1. By fulfilling Ebina’s request Hikigaya saved Hayama’s clique, which may have changed by Tobe’s confession. Now this group is attached by a thin thread which may not be called as Genuine. This “want to have something real” or “I don’t like facade” was the only thing shared between Hikigaya and Yukino, which Hikigaya discarded in that request. Your reasoning may come as secondary, she might have been hurt by watching Hikigaya sacrificing himself.

      Ebina was familiar with Hikigaya’s way of doing from Rumi’s case. The explanation he gave about humans during the case may have given her an idea that he was as rotten as her. But still then in an unpleasant way he ended the case in favour of Rumi. She guessed he could find her ulterior motive, so she was so roundabout. But didn’t expected it to turnout this way unlike Hayama, as she was quite shocked by his sudden confession. She is rotten but she’s not a bitch.

    • Ebina made a cryptic request because of Yui.
      I believe that Ebina understand Hachiman a lot. She believes that only Hachiman can understand her interior conflict. Yui is a good friend to her, but she thinks that showing her heart to Yui would push her away.
      Ebina is usually pretty open in stupid things, but as Miura stated, she’s a totally close book on serious matters.

    • @broditora
      ” By fulfilling Ebina’s request Hikigaya saved Hayama’s clique, which may have changed by Tobe’s confession. Now this group is attached by a thin thread which may not be called as Genuine. This “want to have something real” or “I don’t like facade” was the only thing shared between Hikigaya and Yukino,”
      What do u mean to say by this? I can’t understand

    • Also Ebina is a bitch, she must have known that 8Man uses the method which hurts somebody and since he can’t hurt Hayama’s group so it was obvious only members ofservice club will perish

    • “What do u mean to say by this? I can’t understand”

      Listen to the opening song.

      “konna repurikawa iranai
      We don’t need these kinds of replicas
      “honmono”to yoberu monodakede ii
      We only need something that can be called “the real thing””

      In contrast to the fake and shallow relationships in Hayama’s group, both Hachiman and Yukino are looking for something real, something genuine. In the same sense both Yukinoshita and Hachiman hate lies. I think it’s in Volume 8 where Hachiman says in his thoughts that he wants something more, something genuine.

    • @Rahul Kumar your accusement to Ebina is unjust. As a LN reader in this blog you should understand in vol 7 (and hope in further volumes) that she didn’t mean it to turn out this way. And I agree to what @m0h said. She was wary of Yuigahama when placing the request.

      It is not because I have read other volumes that I am defending her, but she is quite different from another well known bitch ahem ahem ***ami. Ebina knows her fault, her darkness within but she doesn’t blame others or run away from it. She will ask for help when she is at wits end. I can’t explain it properly without spoiling you. But if she knew that her request will put strain in the service club, she would have never asked for their help. Even if she asked for their help knowing the result, she would later be continuing her life blaming herself, and carry this guilt feeling in her. Ohhh…. I remembered a line said by Yuigahama in vol 8.

      And be ready for a ride in this season for Hikki-toki.

    • @broditoria
      “Ebina knows her fault, her darkness within but she doesn’t blame others or run away from it. She will ask for help when she is at wits end.”
      “But if she knew that her request will put strain in the service club, she would have never asked for their help. Even if she asked for their help knowing the result, she would later be continuing her life blaming herself, and carry this guilt feeling in her.”

      How do u know Ebina is that kind of girl? From volume 8, 9 or 10

      @Kawasomething says: “Ebina is fully aware that there’s a superficiality to the current status of her group with Hayama and cohorts and also acknowledges that it pains her to see that superficiality perpetuated and that there is a selfishness to her desires, but at the same time it’s something that she doesn’t want to lose because the current state of the group allows her some measure of comfort and happiness, a place of solace from whatever unspoken difficulties are part of her life elsewhere, and for that group to potentially splinter apart could be pretty damaging. Burying the tensions within the group back underground is easier and less painful, if of course temporary and inconclusive.”

      Didn’t it makes all three (Hayama, Miura and Ebina) shitty person. To enjoy there youth they agrees seek help from the person about whom they didn’t cared and whom they hate. They didn’t even cared about feeling of 8Man and were ready even if he or other people will suffer just to maintain there happy life

      I think that ALL THREE OF THEM( Hayama, Miura, Ebina) ARE SELFISH SHITS. THE KIND OF PEOPLE I HATE THE MOST. THEY HAVE SOME IF NOT ALL THE TRAITS OF SAGAMIN- DESIRE TO MAINTAIN THERE LIFE STYLE EVEN IF SOMEONE WILL SUFFER BECAUSE OF THAT

    • By the way @broditoria when Ebina says she is rotten what does she imply to
      1) Being a BL lover
      2) Relying on false relationship for soothing her heart

    • @Rahul Kumar
      Hayama didn’t care about Hachiman? Are you paying attention to what Hayama says?

      “You were the last person I wanted to rely on…”
      “I’m sorry.”
      “I knew that was the only way you could do things, and yet…”

      In the end, he relied on Hachiman BUT he didn’t want to have to rely on him. If there was another way he wouldn’t have asked Hachiman. The fact that he apologized shows he cares. Someone who doesn’t care has no reason to apologize.
      It’s true that Miura doesn’t care about Hachiman but there was no reason for her to care in the first place. They’re not friends or anything. As for Ebina, I don’t think she meant to put strain on the service club; she probably underestimated Tobe’s feelings.

      I don’t think being rotten is specifically referring to her being a fujoshi or relying on the clique. Ebina is implying that she wouldn’t make a good girlfriend (i.e. she has some personality problems such as not reading the situation which is the exact opposite of Yui). It probably is related to her family or her past.

    • Basically what @yithar said:
      As for Ebina being rotten is a figurative speech of her personality. Hikigaya first detected her motive behind her fujoshi mask, I think in vol 4 or 3. You can read it in nanodesu’s blog.
      HHmmmm…. As for what kind of person Ebina is, I deduced it by watching the episode 2 of season 2. She is enjoying her life now and doesn’t want it to change. Maybe she had some kind of past we don’t know. As she said it has been a while since she felt like that, and doesn’t want to lose it. She liked the people around her. So she hate herself to keep the status quo. At a level she does have a sense of her own cowardice.

      And my personal view is you can’t say Hayama’s clique is totally a superficial group. They all care about each other. Miura was quite angry with Yuigahama since she didn’t speak her mind, during the Tennis match and selection of Cult-Fest member she was concerned about Yui. She always looks after berserk Ebina. Hayama was quite upset about the chain mail since it was against his friends( it’s a different case that it was started by one of them, but latter they formed a good friendship-bond). He doesn’t want to see any fight between his friends.
      Now the thing is that they don’t want to cross over the line. Since Miura knows Ebina’s cold personality and Hayama knows that once it is lost it’s difficult to retrieve(Maybe implying his and Yukinoshita’s past relationship). So they are afraid to step over.

    • @ broditoria Just read volume 7 again and I must confess Hayama was not a shit. He was sad when 8Man sacrificed himself. He is just a fool for wanting everyone to be happyand no one to be hurt because it is impossible as saving one person means being not able to save another. But he is selfish because when given choice instead of himself being hurt or seeing his group hurt he let 8Man and service club to suffer
      And Ebina now I think also is not shit but a little selfish
      But I yhink Miura is a bitch but well I hvn’t read furthe volumes so can”t say about her

  35. Oh also sorry but third question
    Hachiman said at the end that the biggest liar is himself, what was he referring?
    1. fake confession?
    2. that no one got hurt (obviously he got hurt)?

  36. Your insights regarding the episode and their relationships was really eye-opening! It just shows how much depth these scenes have than what I thought they would have. Episode was pretty good too, its just the transitions are really jarring when you have read the LNs.

  37. Irohafags LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL Team Yukino all the way, da only way!

    But yea I agree with Spyro, Yukino and Yui also probably don’t want to see Hachiman deprecate and lower himself for the sake of others, kinda like watching your friend take a bullet for someone he has no connection to over and over just to get hurt, mocked, and ridiculed in the process. Just a little extra opinion for me.

    • I see a lot of Hayama haters. But I think he closely resemble human nature. Pretense outside helpless inside. Not that I’m a big fan of his, but I can see where he stands. Still then I’m in your club.

    • No @broditoria U are underestimating human nature only few humans will sacrifice others for their gain. People like Hayama are in mionrity not majority

    • I wouldn’t go so far to classify him like that since he means well. It’s just he has this “everyone” mindset, trying to consider everyone in the his group even if the relationships seem one-dimensional. And that sort of mindset is what make Hayama interesting as a character since he might be smart and athletic, as well as popular and a heart-throb towards a lot of his admirers, but he lacks what the Service Club and Hachiman has compared to him.

      Note: Basically his faults are what make Hayama a great character in the whole series (too lazy to proof-read if my reply is articulate)

    • @ Rahul Kumar why are you associating Hayama to someone who sacrifices other. To me he is like everyone lets get along, but when time comes he is unable to decide or take one particular side. In vol 7, Hikigaya says that since he has a lot of choices he can’t select any particular.

    • Just read volume 7 again and I must confess Hayama was not a shit. He was sad when 8Man sacrificed himself. He is just a fool for wanting everyone to be happyand no one to be hurt because it is impossible as saving one person means being not able to save another. But he is selfish because when given choice instead of himself being hurt or seeing his group hurt he let 8Man and service club to suffer

  38. My expectations for the rollercoaster scene and the “something genuine” scene are going out of control too !

  39. So, I’m confused about the ebina and hachiman heart-to-heart. When Ebina said that she liked the way things are, but she hates herself, does that imply that she doesn’t enjoy lying just to prevent change? Does her dialogue also apply to Hachiman as well? Maybe he truly is hurt by the actions he committed, but he is deceiving himself of not caring about it.

    • She probably hates herself cause she can’t change.
      Ebina too wants something genuine, but she can’t cause she’s rotten. And she’s very aware that no one likes a rotten person.
      That’s why a shallow relationship it’s ok by now, but at the same time she hates being ok with it.

  40. Haven’t yet watched the episode but I know volume 7 pretty well. Don’t think yukino was upset because he protected something superficial,that’s more of
    volume 8. its really his methods she is frustrated by, as she gets closer to him she is starting to hurt when she sees him get hurt, and thats why at the beginning of volume 8 she refuses to work with him because of the suicidal method he proposes, she is trying to save him from himself.

    What im stil dying to know is what it is yukino is looking for that haruno and hikki are missing, and what exactly it is she is trying to save.

    • I won’t argue against her liking his self-destructive tendencies, but you need to reread the early chapters of volume 8. She specifically mentions how Hachiman was supposed to hate superficiality.

  41. To tell you the truth… I think they are running too much over the LN story line… I don’t know if you, LN readers, will agree with me, but I’m finding this anime a bit silly in fact. I agreed with Spyro that the general lines are being transmitted, but still… A lot of changes between characters were lost. Am I exaggerating? Spyro?

    • I would guess that the reason you probably find the anime a bit silly is simply because the storyline is still more light hearted at this point in the series in contrast to the latest volumes where things becomes a lot more heavy/serious and the characters are more fleshed out/mature. Don’t forget that the earlier volumes even had a classic “silly” male protag sees girls undressing scene.

    • @Anon-kun: I think the undressing scene was supposed to be satire and to illustrate a little bit of humor with the title of the series.

    • In my observation:

      For Yukinon: when Hikki first declined the food, Yui then offered it to Yukino, when Yukino is currently eating the food, she “commands” 8man to help eat too, when 8man finally relents, i think yukino in her mind that 8man obeys her.

      For Yui: they shared the same food(?) hey this is the same people who cares about indirect kisses. Specifically hachiman accepts what yui had offered, twice.

      Or they are both just embarassed because 8man ravage the first food given to him.

  42. After reading these much comments one thing is unclear in my mind
    Why does Yukinon disliked his proposal to Ebina
    1) She loves him?
    2) She hated seeing him getting hurt
    3) She didn’t liked the fact that he helped Ebina whereas he hates shallow relationship
    4) All of them
    5) 2 and 3
    Anyone can clear that up?

  43. Yui and Yukino have been upset with his self sacrifice for a while, mainly because they see that he uses it as an excuse to not seek friends. They are not only upset that this is incredibly self destructive where 8man has become an outcast hated by everyone from his own doing, but also because doing this means 8man distances himself from the service club, because by his logic everyone hates him and real friends don’t exist. He is in a way rejecting Yukino and Yui even as friends, as well as not seeking for their help and input even though they’re supposed to be colleagues.
    Despite seeming not to value a meaningful partnership with Yukino and Yui, 8man still talks with them and goes shopping with them on occasion, things friends would do. You see where I’m going with this? By sticking to his logic of society sucks/it’s impossible to have meaningful relationships and also continuing to hang out with Yui and Yukino, 8man has created the very thing he claims to hate, a superficial relationship. And with what he did in episode 2 he has spectacularly defended 2 superficial relationships in favor of searching for something meaningful: Hayama’s group, and the service club.
    Damn, I never looked at it like that.

  44. You wouldn’t mind me quoting this post on some other places, right? MaL to be precise, people there are too busy complaining about this turning into a soap opera, becoming over dramatic, Yukino being a bitch, being a mere shadow of the first season, Hachiman and Yukino being entirely different characters — how they didn’t receive enough development by the end of s1 (how about that?!) for any major changes and how 8man changing means show is becoming shit etc etc etc to actually pay attention to any of the nuances. I don’t think I can expound on the details any better even if I tried and you’ve done it already, so..

  45. 2 Eps and here we end the 7th Volume. If they keep this pace, i wonder in which volume it’ll be on eps 12 (assuming they only make 12 – 13 eps)

    Will it reach volume 10 and leave a HUGE CLIFFHANGER to everyone who didn’t read the novel? Or in volume 9 as we (me and some of my friend) expect? Geh

    • Chances are that S2 will end in a cliffhanger of sorts and the producers will end the animation series with an OVA once the material for volume 11 comes out (which i believe is the conclusion to oregairu).

  46. awesome thoughts! XD you make it simple what was on the surface and what was undernieth most of people probably didn’t see all that in the anime even the novel

    obs. it’s weird how good it feels when people understend a thing you like so much the same way we do … and the fact that people will read that post and understands better .. i don’t know why but it feels good XD

    sorry bad english

  47. Great episode, and great essay about it too here..

    Well, there’s many good scenes here, like Zaimokuza sleeping scene, or Yukinoshita eating while talking scene, plus Hayama’s expression in the riverbed (Nice change for the always smiling Hayama before), etc…

    The music also nice to build the climax, but I feel that fits an action anime better..

    Komachi and Kamakura scene is also nice… (nee, Kaa-kun)…

    But Kamakura looks more like a wild cat now than before…

    And that cat seems has a trauma with the word ‘play’…haha

    Waiting for the third episode…

  48. Spyro san is there a forum for discussing Oregairu, I mean every one don’t come here online everyday for discussing somethng and I have few questions to ask so is there a forum?

  49. Talking about Hayama vs Hachiman clique, where ones wants something true, and the other ones treasure everything even if it has to be fake: Yuigahama is standing right in the middle of them!

  50. Just read volume 7 again and I must confess Hayama was not a shit. He was sad when 8Man sacrificed himself. He is just a fool for wanting everyone to be happyand no one to be hurt because it is impossible as saving one person means being not able to save another. But he is selfish because when given choice instead of himself being hurt or seeing his group hurt he let 8Man and service club to suffer

  51. “So let’s talk a little about Hachiman (and Yukino).”
    Thank you Spyro san this really cleared my mind about their personality and their relationship
    U are a really great writer
    Thank u again

  52. Although I agree with most of what Excorsism says, there are two things that do not coincide with your line of argumentation regarding Yukino’s reaction.

    “上手く説明できなくてもどかしいのだけど、あなたのそのやり方とても嫌い”
    This sentence supports your hypothesis of Yukino being angry because of Hachiman once again sacrificing himself. On a side note, I appreciate your post for pointing out that this is regardless of whether she has romantic feelings for him or not.

    However, this same sentence does not support your hypothesis that she is disappointed in Hachiman since he rescued something superficial which is against his ideal of genuineness. If that was the case, wouldn’t she point out that the price he had to pay for his act was not worth of the reward, i.e. saving superficial relationships among a group of individuals?

    Furthermore, her phrase uses “way of doing things” which can be interpreted as his method of sacrificing himself to fulfill a request. In contrast,

    Finally, it is the first time that Hachiman rescues something superficial. Yet it feels that Yukino refers with her “way of doing things” to his general solution to solving issues rather than the particular solution in this case. I am aware that this may be subjective, but the above mentioned phrase by Yukinon is more likely to refer to a specific way of doing things of a certain person rather than a specific action.

    Evidence can also be found in Yui’s phrase “こういうのもうなしね?”, where Yui refers to this specific action by Hachiman. Therefore, I tentatively conclude that Yukino would have said something similar to “このやり方とても嫌い”, if she intended to show her disappointment in Hachiman’s action.

    My second point is regarding the superficiality of the group that Hachiman protected with his action. This point was already raised by @broditoria above. Although most relationships between the group may be superficial, there are links such as between Hayama and Yui or Ebina and Miura to name a few that have more depth. Hence, it is questionable if this group is something not worth rescuing even for Hachiman.

    If this group is not worth saving, why did Hachiman save the Bunkasai? It is questionable that a genuineness/superficiality analysis of the Bunkasai would conclude in a high genuineness rating.

    In conclusion, I support your hypothesis of Yukino getting angry for Hachiman sacrificing himself. However, I do not see enough evidence that would support your second argument with Yukino not approving Haciman’s action as it is against his ideals.

    • If that was the case, wouldn’t she point out that the price he had to pay for his act was not worth of the reward, i.e. saving superficial relationships among a group of individuals?

      Well, as I stated, she understands what he did, but at the same time, doesn’t. Hence, why she isn’t able to explain it properly. And mind you, this is all stuff that happened in the span of a few minutes, so her head was pretty much shot when he pulled his stunt out of nowhere. The only thing she could say was she hates his way of doing things.

      Furthermore, her phrase uses “way of doing things” which can be interpreted as his method of sacrificing himself to fulfill a request.

      It can be interpreted in plenty of ways, yes, and that all depends on how you see Hachiman’s methods. Consider all the requests he’s solved so far. There was Yui’s cookie request, Hayama’s clique with the boys, Kawasaki, and so forth. There really wasn’t any “self-sacrificing” in those solutions. The actual “self-sacrifice” begins in volume 6 with the Cultural Festival. So what do all those solutions have in common? There’s no “change”. Remember how Hachiman talked about “change is to run away from the situation” in volume 1? In Yui’s request, instead of making her change to get better at cooking, he manipulates her mindset to not worry about the taste. Same thing with Rumi, instead of forcing Rumi to change to work with the people around her, just destroy how people saw each other, and reset the situation. At the heart of the issue, all his solutions really do is push things to the backburner; they’re all temporary solutions, but they’re consistent with who he is. Hachiman’s methods aren’t mainly about taking all the pain, but by not being superficial and changing just because your environment, society, people, etc demanded you to.

      Evidence can also be found in Yui’s phrase “こういうのもうなしね?”, where Yui refers to this specific action by Hachiman. Therefore, I tentatively conclude that Yukino would have said something similar to “このやり方とても嫌い”, if she intended to show her disappointment in Hachiman’s action.

      I’m not really sure if you can call that evidence. Yui and Yukino had different thoughts on the matter, so I don’t think they’re correlated at all.

      Although most relationships between the group may be superficial, there are links such as between Hayama and Yui or Ebina and Miura to name a few that have more depth.

      Except Hachiman and Yukino for that matter don’t really know that. Three people of the group (and two of them being the heart of the group) told him directly that they wanted to keep the group together because they’re comfortable and are afraid of it collapsing. How else do you expect an outsider like Hachiman or even Yukino to interpret this? If they really do enjoy being together, a simple confession shouldn’t destroy the group so easily, right?

      If this group is not worth saving, why did Hachiman save the Bunkasai? It is questionable that a genuineness/superficiality analysis of the Bunkasai would conclude in a high genuineness rating.

      The Cultural Festival was a completely different situation. I’m not sure what you’re trying to get at here. Superficiality wasn’t really the idea behind that arc. It was supposed to highlight Hachiman’s disposition regarding himself and him getting the request done in accordance with what Yukino was requested to do; that is, have Sagami act as the Committee Chairperson until the very end. It was also to not let Yukino’s efforts go to waste since she worked the hardest of everyone during that period to the point of collapsing.

      I should’ve prefaced that my explanation is built slightly upon volume 8. Admittedly, this is because the actual clear evidence of what she was angry at (that being, his act of saving the superficial) comes up in volume 8, while all the volumes up to 7 serve as the foundation as for why she was angry. To be honest, I’m still unsure about a few things and while I’d love to go back and reread, translating’s taking up all my time.

    • Spyro u just said that 8Man’s solutions are temporary, ae u sure?
      Sorry if I offended u in any way but it seems like he offers a long term solution like in case of Rumi he resets the bonding of people surrounding her so she can have a fresh start and can make friends. also in case of Yui he calms down her mindso she can actually cook better

    • @Rahul Kumar: Except that Hikigaya’s solution didn’t provide a permanent solution; although he did reset the relationships between Rumi and her “friends”, Rumi was still alone and from what we’ve known so far it didn’t look like Rumi reconciled with her past friends. Hikigaya’s methods only provide an efficient but temporary solution (kind of like a shortcut to the answer) that don’t work in the long run. Like Yuigahama, although Hachiman was able to persuade her with his fallacy, it didn’t actually solve her request, since she’s still terrible at cooking and all he did was stop herself from worrying about her cooking for just a moment.

      I think in a way, you can think of Hachiman’s methods like dusting the mess under the carpet; the mess is still there but on the surface the floor looks clean. You can even apply it to the arc where Hachiman made his fake confession to Ebina. Although he was able to save Tobe from being rejected, there’s still that tension since Tobe still has a crush on Ebina and Ebina has to eventually confront Tobe’s confession. Hachiman’s methods only preserve the status quo but don’t actually go deep and solve the root of the problem, so that is why his methods are temporary.

  53. What exactly is this “superficial” thing that everyone keeps on talking about, why does Hachiman and Yukino hate superficiality…Sorry if this has an obvious answer

  54. That’s just the way he is :”Monster of reason” as described by Hiratsuka. While Hachiman gained a lot of perks since middle school he lost (actually just locked) something he shouldn’t, his heart. In pursuit of the best and rational solution he disregards the feelings of those close to him. That is something he will understand someday

    • I think Hachiman simply locked his heart to prevent being hurt. He looks for rational solutions because he doesn’t want to get involved with his feelings and he doesn’t want to risk getting hurt in the process.
      I believe that Hachiman has a very sensitive heart ( that’s why he helps everyone ) , but he hides it in order to not being hurt yet again.

      That’s why Hachiman hates nice girls: he doesn’t want to get hurt from his own delusions…

    • I think m0h has it spot on. I can really relate to Hachiman. When you don’t want to get hurt anymore, you close your heart and start building walls. And only really nice people tend to help others with no benefit to themselves.

  55. Okay, Spyro. I now I’m being a dick here, but how do I follow this site’s pages updates, some history, maybe? It’s a bit painful tracking down each and every minor change by comparing pages line by line.

    I mean, i-it’s not like don’t want to miss a single word from you or anything.

  56. Well i think actually miura is the nicest of all in hayato group, she only give warning to hachiman and service club to stay out of my trouble unlike hayama and ebina that request hachiman to countering tobe confession.

    i also think hachiman saved service club too, actually they’re already doomed when they accept tobe request because if it’s failed they will become a scapegoat or branded as the one that destroy hayama group relationship, maybe yukinon understand this a little so eventhough she is angry, she can’t give any retort.

Leave a Reply

Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in:

WordPress.com Logo

You are commenting using your WordPress.com account. Log Out / Change )

Twitter picture

You are commenting using your Twitter account. Log Out / Change )

Facebook photo

You are commenting using your Facebook account. Log Out / Change )

Google+ photo

You are commenting using your Google+ account. Log Out / Change )

Connecting to %s